martin 244 sailboat

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Has any one ever sailed or know anything about Martin 244's? I can't find anything on these boats. There are a few comments on SA, but it doesn't sound like any first hand knowledge. Sailboat Data doesn't even list them as existing, but they do, because there are a handful for sail on Kijiji. Things I'm curious about. Do people cruise with them, or are they strictly racers? Can they be reasonably trailered? I definitely like the idea of supporting a Canadian sailboat manufacturer that is currently in business. I can't even find contact information for the company that builds them.  

The 244 could be 'cruised', much as its predecessor the 242 could be cruised, but it's cockpit camping, no amenties below (maybe a portapotti). The 244 was developed for a local sailing club 3 innovative clubs for boating fanatics without boats as a training boat. It's an interesting design, with a lift keel and somewhat radical cockpit seating (very 'tubular'.. kind of holds you in place.) I've not sailed one but have had a close look. They are also furnished with a 'fat head main' but don't really have a stiff enough rig to support it so they do suffer a bit in a breeze. We owned a 242 for 15 years or so, hard to find a simpler, 'funner' boat in that size range. (some of the newer Melges types are much quicker, but at a price) I'd go for a 242 over a 244 - don't see what the 244 offers besides better trailerability and a higher price. I believe they are built in Kelowna.BC  

I had a feeling you might know something about these boats. I have found one (possibly several) for a very reasonable price. I don't like the sound of the floppy rig. Do you know anything more about the lifting keel arrangement? I am interested in a boat I can trailer. I can see the keel trunk in one of the pics, but can't really figure out what's going on. Is the keel unbolted for trailering? Edit: the ad States the rig has been beefed up for great lakes conditions. I'm not really sure what that means though.  

Arcb said: .... Do you know anything more about the lifting keel arrangement? I am interested in a boat I can trailer. .... Click to expand...

I spoke to the broker today (I like doing a little bit of research on a boat before talking to a broker so I don't get charmed into making an 11 hour return trip for an unsuitable boat). He basically confirmed everything Faster said but with a more positive spin. Although I think the price is incredible for a basically new 24' boat, I don't think it would be an adequate cruiser for me. They don't even have porta potties. It seems they are primarily day sailers that are too Racey for comfortable cruising, but not as fast as other similar sized modern racing boats. The broker assured me they could comfortably sleep 4 adults and judging by the pics, I believed him. Looks like a great find for some one, but I think 24' is a lot of boat for what is essentially a day sailer. The keel is a bolt on semi permanent lifting keel like a Melges, which is pretty cool. It seems like a good solution for trailering.  

Arcb said: ....I don't think it would be an adequate cruiser for me..... Click to expand...

Did a bit more research.. the 244 rates quite a bit faster than the 242 (~115 vs 168 for the later - may vary regionally) but I'm not positive the boat will sail to that rating in all conditions. The bump is likely due to the increased area of the fathead main - but as mentioned without a carbon spar it's hard to make that sail work to its potential. We see the training 244s out on the bay frequently, and granted they are being sailed by relative newbies (although with a skipper/instructor, as a rule) and it's easy to see that those mains cannot be trimmed optimally. The trailer-ability is much enhanced with the lift keel, though, no question about that. Have you looked at a Santana 20? Fixed keel but I have seen them trailered on occasion Santana 20 sailboat for sale Also going to re-mention the Holder, and the similar Hotfoot 20 (not many made, though).. A story here DIY Speedshop: From beast to beauty, a boat's rebirth | Sailing World Your original premise was some cruising ability, I don't think you'll get much in less than 24 feet.  

Take a look at the Seascape 24. Fast, easy to rig, float off trailer with a lifting keel... I don't have any experience with the 24, but the 18 and 27 are very very well made. Simple, but high quality.  

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Downsizer’s dream, it’s hard to resist the marketing to go bigger, but which boat will deliver more fun on the water.

As I enter retirement, my interests are changing. My obsession with serious mountaineering and technical rock climbing has relaxed to easy climbing at the local crag with the old crew and walks in the woods. I ride my bicycle more than I have since college; I like the movement. And I no longer have much interest in cruising far, or really any big adventure. I’ve been there, seen that, and proven all that I need to.

I find myself more interested in the motion and the feel, and less attracted to the scale and commitment required by big adventures. I’ve also learned that Baloo had it exactly right . . .  at least for an old guy like me:

“And don’t spend your time lookin’ around For something you want that can’t be found When you find out you can live without it And go along not thinkin’ about it I’ll tell you something true The bare necessities of life will come to you.”

Boat shows feed two-footitis. It’s their purpose. They nurture the human need to impress neighbors. They dole out shame if  your boat moves with the waves and isn’t as comfortable as a suite at the Hilton.

They fully understand the Walter Mitty in many of us and feed the dream of a world cruise will transport you away from the office grind. As a result, people are funneled into boats that really aren’t best for the kind of sailing they will actually do. And so as the crowds at the boat show gawk at every boat that is two or four feet longer than the one they have, I find myself fascinated by nimble, smaller craft.

Selling my PDQ 34 catamaran last year was like selling a family home full of memories. It had been a gathering spot. There is a also loss in prestige; somehow I was less successful as a man, a personal failure because my boat is little now, even though for me a boat was never about money. It was a tool for cruising. Possessions are a stupid way to measure yourself or life, really, but we are trained to accumulate them as proof we have moved upwards. Is moving down giving up? It shouldn’t be.

The older I get, I also hate seeing waste. It’s just so … wasteful. My cruising bug satisfied and my interests refocused on day sailing, the big cat was all wrong and I feel smart that I sold her before I became burned out and she declined from disuse.

I didn’t come to sailing because I wanted to go far. I came to sailing because I enjoyed the interaction of wind and waves, being close to the water, and being outdoors. Cruising is something that happened for 15 years, triggered by the joys of discovery I could share with my family and child. But I can’t say I ever loved a cruising boat. And so I’ve returned to my sailing roots, piloting something small and nimble that feels the wind. I love my F-24.

What is it like having a smaller boat again?

• There is still maintenance, but the maintenance is easier to manage.
• I can enjoy sailing in lighter winds and smaller waters. Tacking is fun again.
• There is just as much to think about when sailing, and that’s good. It’s a performance boat, with lots of strings to pull, but she’s calm and safe if I reef early.
• I no longer worry about resale value. I need to keep her safe, nimble, and reliable, but not polished unless I feel like it.
• There’s no guilt if she sits for a few weeks, a month or even several. In actuality, I sail her more often, because it’s easier to jump aboard and go. I still sail in the winter—that’s what drysuits are for.
• I can trailer to faraway places if I want to, but I don’t. She’ll live in a slip.

I’ve become the classic old guy, wearing a flat hat and tearing around windy roads in my Spitfire with the top down. She won’t fit the whole family, but she fits me, my wife, my daughter, and a picnic basket.

I like the new size of my life.

Drew Frye is the technical editor of Practical Sailor. He blogs at www.sailingdelmarva.com.

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This is spot on! While I never was as active as the writer in sailing or mountaineering, in my late 60’s I revisited owning a boat cautiously. My choice ended up being a little known and perhaps orphaned class Martin 244. Billed as a racer/ cruiser it ultimately is a 24’ lightweight flexible daysailer and quite affordable. Also trailerable, and while that was my original plan, moorage is quite reasonable and 45 minutes from living room to hoisting the main and falling off the wind means I say yes to a day sail without hesitation.

Thank you for summing up my feelings about downsizing. We have had several wonderful cruising boats, all in the 30′ size and really enjoyed them, but used them less each year. Now I have the smallest boat in the marina (17’Cornish Crabber) and enjoy it for all the reasons you mention. My neighbours, in their multi hundred thousand dollar power boats, also tell me that more people stop to look at my boat than any other on the marina, especially their’s! Any size sailing boat gives pleasure, but the great thing about sailing is that a wonderful daysail in a small seaworthy boat can be as memorable as any other type of sailing. I don’t trailer sail as I only live 4 minutes from the marina, so can be underway in less than 10 minutes from leaving home

Exactly. My goal is a boat I can just jump in and go.

This week is boat work and bottom painting week. Smaller is nice!

I sailed a lot as a young man, but life got in the way. I was thinking about getting a boat, but if I do, it’ll be a smaller, easier to manage boat for the reasons you stated.

I’ve been a motorcyclist most of my adult life. I’ve had big, fast bikes, but I no longer do. In fact, I have a small bike: a Royal Enfield Meteor 350. I got it for the same reasons you got your F-24. In fact, as I read your thought process behind downsizing your boat, I felt like I was reading my OWN thoughts! Small and simple are beautiful, no matter what you’re doing… 🙂

I’m 57 years old, one of my former careers was as an officer on everything from an ammunition ship for Desert Storm to Captain on a 58′ Bertram. I have always loved sailing but wasn’t willing to spare the time and money as I allowed my professional life get in the way. Now a financial advisor with still little extra time but thinking about working less I stumbled across a friend selling an old (1982) but well outfitted US22 for $2,500. She’s no racer but very forgiving. Living in SW Florida the wee hours are when it is cool enough to be comfortable. The vast majority of my sailing consists of arising at oh-God thirty, getting out there with sails up and engine off, propping up my feet with my coffee and a donut to watch the sunrise. I’m heading back to the dock about the time all the nuts are just coming out.

Although I find myself looking at larger boats, in the end I keep coming back to the conclusion that I mostly need my small, old, worn sailboat that is easy to sail and low maintenance (I replaced all exterior teak with high density marine grade plastic and she was already scuffed up so who cares). I can bareboat charter a monohull somewhere interesting almost anywhere on the planet an awful lot of times before I get even close to the cost of buying and owning a larger boat that I would use less often. If I ever find myself at a point in my life that I am likely to spend months cruising, then I will reconsider. For now I’m not going anywhere anyhow so who cares how fast she is or how she looks. I just want to watch the sunrise and the dolphins when they swing by for a visit.

You have a GREAT idea! Enjoy the small boat and charter if you want to cruise somewhere. I like it… 🙂

There is more to downsizing than just day or weekend sailing. What if you want to live permanently on the boat? All the same adages apply, the bare necessities, as small as possible but no smaller and keep it simple.

I worry about the sheer amount of kit, especially electronics, that the average yacht carries onboard and the complexity that people think is essential now. At best, every single thing that is not absolutely required is something to be maintained, repaired or replaced in the future. At worst, it may fail at the least convenient moment when you have previously relied upon it.

Downsizing is about the bare necessities and emphasising basic seamanship above all else.

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The Martin 243 is a 24.0ft fractional sloop designed by Don Martin and built in fiberglass by Martin Yachts Ltd. (CAN) since 1998.

14 units have been built..

The Martin 243 is an ultralight sailboat which is a very high performer. It is reasonably stable / stiff and has a low righting capability if capsized. It is best suited as a racing boat.

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“Sailing re-invented!” That was the guiding statement for Don Martin (think Martin 242) and Forbes Cooper (West Coast boat building guru), the design/manufacturing team that set out to create a cruiser/racer that was easy to sail, trailerable and an eye-catching design. All for a price that wouldn’t break the bank! Building upon their combined experience in the yachting world and drawing greatly on Don Martin’s recent involvement with the America’s Cup they created the M244. Locally designed, locally built and locally sailed, the M244 is a true West Coast creation. Every penny of your purchasing power goes into the boat – not into customs fees and import duties! The M244 comes ready to sail with mainsail and furling jib, all running rigging, quarterberth cushions (it sleeps 4 – a double bunk in the v-berth and two single berths in the main cabin), The M244 is easily trailerable and can be rigged and sailing in less than an hour.

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J24 vs Martin 242

• Thread starter divinebovine
• Start date Nov 15, 2009
• Forums for All Owners
• Ask All Sailors

divinebovine

So I'm looking for a sailboat in the 24 foot range that has a good one design class in the Pacific Northwest area, but also I want to be able to cruise her single handed, and take friends out on little day trips... Anyone know what the length of the v-berth in the j24 is? Any pros and cons of these two boat designs would be greatly appreciated! thanks all!  

Barnacle Bill

Well, first of all, if you are talking one designs, I would think the J/Boat would be a much better choice because it is the 2nd largest one design keel boat class in the world (the Star boat is #1). The Martin is 242 is obscure by comparison. But, you have to check the fleets in the area you wish to sail. If there is a Martin 242 fleet and no J/24 fleets, then you know the boat of preference if you wish to race. But, my bet is you'll find a J/24 fleet. Call up a local J/Boat dealer and they will tell you where they are. The J/24 is really quite roomy below because of her generous beam, but it only has sitting headroom. All the berths are long enough for most tall people. The boat sails very well, but not like a modern J/Boat. Remember the J/24 was the first boat Rod and Bob Johnstone built in their garage some 30 years ago and while the design remains the same, modern J/24's have been retooled and are much better built than the early ones. They are still built today by Waterline Systems in Rhode Island. The Martin 242 also has sitting headroom. I am not as familiar with the interior layout, so don't know how it is for sleeping. I know it has a good reputation for keen sailing.  

I just talked to a sailor friend who is a California/Hawaii sailor and he says the Martin 242's are popular in the Pacific NW and there are fleets. But, he thinks the J/24 is a better all around boat.  

I think you need to evaluate your need / wants. Is it a racing sailboat or a cruising sailboat you are looking for? I have sailed both the M242 and T-bird 26 a lot and have had a J24 as a marina stable mate. They are fast racing machines but defiantly not cruising sailboats. They are very tender and wet with very limited cruising facilities, and difficult to single-hand because of all of the sail controls. I had a Hunter 23 wing keel and found her to be very easy to single-hand with a tiller pilot and furling/reefing headsail. She was surprisingly fast, similar to a Cat-25/27 but not as fast as a M242. She could take a surprising about of heavy weather with the two mainsail reefs. In the ten years that I owned her, I have single-handed crossed the “pond” to Nanaimo in every month of the year including in winds up to 30 kts and waves to 1½ metres. Average speed about 5 kts (6 hours from T-bird marina) with a max of 9 kts surfing down the back of some long rollers after a NW storm. I now have a CAL 2-25. This in not the old flat-top CAL 25 of the 1960’s but a modern design that has a longer waterline length than a Cat-27, stand-up headroom, large berths, enclosed head, Yanmar diesel and interior room about the same as a Cat-27. She is still economical to maintain, berth and single-hand but a much sturdier sailor. Probably a better bet for both racing and sailing is something like a C&C-25 or 26, Mirage-25, Kelt-7.6 or Cat-27. For racing only, you should add the older CAL-25 and SJ-24 to your list but of the two you are considering I would cast my vote for the M242. This is a good time of the year to buy a boat as the prices are very low but in our area you have to consider the availability and cost of moorage. You may want to get your name on a number of marina waitlists (some will want a fee to be waitlisted). Don’t look at only one marina and don’t wait until you buy a sailboat as very few boat come with a marina berth. A good sailboat like you are considering should cost about $10,000 to $15,000, insurance about $300 to $400 / year and moorage about $3000-3,500 / year +/- 20%. You should also budget on repairs/upgrades that could be very minimal or very extensive (expensive), depending on the initial condition and your racing requirements.  

Awesome thanks all for your comments! I've looked at the SJ-24 and raced against it quite a bit, but even sailing smaller slower boats against it, managed to just walk away from it... I would mostly have the boat for one-design racing, as well as club races and the odd weekend cruise... Ideally I would rather have the M242 or J24 for the resale, as I would most likely be moving up to a larger boat sometime down the line... One thing I have read about J24s is they like to sink from time to time... I realize this is a problem to due with pushing your boat past your crew's limits as well as the vessel's limits. I will look closer at the CAL2-25. Any more comments about these boats will be greatly appreciated! Thanks all!!  

What are people's thoughts about the C&C Shark 24 designed by Hinterhoeler?  

If the guest comfort thing does not bother you From a pure performance standpoint they KILL most any comparable boat upwind and they hold there value well I sold 2733 for 12000 in 1992 and 2930 is still worth 8000 in 2009 You can get like new sails at 1/2 price from the many owners who do the travel circuit and its EASY to find anything for the boat I put a free add for my current J24 on the class web sight and other than one obvious BS response i am shocked at the interest in November  

Nah the guest comfort thing doesn't bother me much.... I like the fact that they hold their value, cuz I'd probably end up selling it in the future when I decide to upgrade to something a bit bigger. I'm 6'1"... Obviously I won't be able to stand up in many boats that perform well in the 22-26 foot range, but I'm fine with that for now... My main concern is if the v-berth is gonna be long enough for me... The M242 has a 6'6" v-berth and the settee berths are also 6'6"  

I am 6'1" and the wife is 5'11" we bought are first J24 as a day sailor/weekend boat and used it that way untill we had are first children Two simple curtains give the porta potty privacy between the forward and aft berths  

sweet thanks for the words of wisdom! Have you ever single handed yours?  

I sail it alone but you need something like a tiller tamer so you can hoist the sails and the main sail really needs to have slugs on it as when you lower a bolt rope main its hard to control solo  

Awesome thanks all for your comments! it's given me lots to think about  

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• Sailboat Guide

Martin 243 is a 24 ′ 0 ″ / 7.3 m monohull sailboat designed by Don Martin and built by Martin Yachts Ltd. starting in 1998.

Rig and Sails

Auxilary power, accomodations, calculations.

The theoretical maximum speed that a displacement hull can move efficiently through the water is determined by it's waterline length and displacement. It may be unable to reach this speed if the boat is underpowered or heavily loaded, though it may exceed this speed given enough power. Read more.

Classic hull speed formula:

Hull Speed = 1.34 x √LWL

Max Speed/Length ratio = 8.26 ÷ Displacement/Length ratio .311 Hull Speed = Max Speed/Length ratio x √LWL

Sail Area / Displacement Ratio

A measure of the power of the sails relative to the weight of the boat. The higher the number, the higher the performance, but the harder the boat will be to handle. This ratio is a "non-dimensional" value that facilitates comparisons between boats of different types and sizes. Read more.

SA/D = SA ÷ (D ÷ 64) 2/3

• SA : Sail area in square feet, derived by adding the mainsail area to 100% of the foretriangle area (the lateral area above the deck between the mast and the forestay).
• D : Displacement in pounds.

Ballast / Displacement Ratio

A measure of the stability of a boat's hull that suggests how well a monohull will stand up to its sails. The ballast displacement ratio indicates how much of the weight of a boat is placed for maximum stability against capsizing and is an indicator of stiffness and resistance to capsize.

Ballast / Displacement * 100

Displacement / Length Ratio

A measure of the weight of the boat relative to it's length at the waterline. The higher a boat’s D/L ratio, the more easily it will carry a load and the more comfortable its motion will be. The lower a boat's ratio is, the less power it takes to drive the boat to its nominal hull speed or beyond. Read more.

D/L = (D ÷ 2240) ÷ (0.01 x LWL)³

• D: Displacement of the boat in pounds.
• LWL: Waterline length in feet

Comfort Ratio

This ratio assess how quickly and abruptly a boat’s hull reacts to waves in a significant seaway, these being the elements of a boat’s motion most likely to cause seasickness. Read more.

Comfort ratio = D ÷ (.65 x (.7 LWL + .3 LOA) x Beam 1.33 )

• D: Displacement of the boat in pounds
• LOA: Length overall in feet
• Beam: Width of boat at the widest point in feet

Capsize Screening Formula

This formula attempts to indicate whether a given boat might be too wide and light to readily right itself after being overturned in extreme conditions. Read more.

CSV = Beam ÷ ³√(D / 64)

Beam incl. wings 15’.

Sail Area: Main: 318 sq ft. Jib: 135 sq ft. Spinnaker: 555 sq ft Crew: 3-4 persons, Max crew wt: 700 lbs

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